UAW offers concessions to help Big Three

CLEAR THE DECKS IN THE EXECUTIVE OFFICES, AND THE UAW, BUT DON’T KILL THE HEARTLAND BAILOUTS are complex, but Try something outside the box like this to save the U.S. Auto Industry - - - http://pacificgatepost.blogspot.com/2008/11/solution-for-detroit-gm-friends.html Toyota and Honda also depend on the same suppliers who feed GM and FORD. No need to let “Detroit” disappear. There is much creative talent hidden inside the U.S. Big 3 that has been smothered by mismanagement and the UAW. ... and they actually "make" something, .... unlike Wall Street.

The UAW killed the goose that laid the Golden egg. The greed of the UAW made the Big 3 bankrupt. The union members didn't care as long they got their benefits paid, their retirement on top of SSI and pay even when the plants closed. The auto industry will survive just fine if UAW cancer is removed.

NO BAILOUT for UAW and US auto industry...wasn't it the CEO of Chrysler was fired as CEO of Home Depot and took millions with him???? What a scam!! BANKRUPTCY is the available means for them, let them prove themselves! The Dems and Obama will want to bail them out...not because of the cars they make...but because they got out the vote!!!! NO NO NO!!!! We are watching!

Reworking the health trust fund, cutting the jobs bank, and eliminating some job protections- we call this concessions? The American public is not going to get behind an auto bailout until the union makes significant WAGE and BENEFIT concessions. Their pay and benefit package is crippling the big 3- and shame on the automakers for negotiating these terrible contracts.

Yesterday on a news piece I saw where the big 3 was cutting back on big advertising. They also said the the advertising added 3,000 to the price of the average vehicle. Disgusiting if you ask me that we have been paying 3,000 more just to look at over the top advertisments. We need to be a no frills country again, back to the basics, down to earth. We have to look at "the big picture." Our days of tunnel vision need to cease. Our nation better wake up and smell the coffee. With all our bail outs along with the 168 billion economic stimulus package, that btw did nothing for our economy it is hard to understand why our government can't see the need to bail us out of our dependence on foreign oil. The high cost of fuel this past year seriously damaged our economy and society. Why don't we invest in America's Energy Independence. It would cost the equivalent of 60 cents per gallon to charge and drive. The electricity used to charge the car could conceivably be generated by solar or wind. Why not invest some of these millions in getting some of these projects set up? Create clean cheap energy, badly needed new green collar jobs and reduce our dependence on foreign oil. What more of a win-win situation could there be? Now there is talk of another stimulus pkg. Don't get me wrong, if you hand me a check I will take it. I am broke from this past year myself. I just read a fascinating book by Jeff Wilson called The Manhattan Project of 2009 Energy Independence NOW. We need to look at the "big picture" This book Is the big picture. www.themanhattanprojectof2009.com

If things are so bad in the auto industry, how is it Honda was able to open a new plant in the U.S. just last month? People who believe the "big 3" and their arguments are completely naive. They also probably think that little elves and fairies will take care of them too.

Janis wrote: Reworking the health trust fund, cutting the jobs bank, and eliminating some job protections- we call this concessions? The American public is not going to get behind an auto bailout until the union makes significant WAGE and BENEFIT concessions. Their pay and benefit package is crippling the big 3- and shame on the automakers for negotiating these terrible contracts. ************************************** Janis sounds like she is jealous of anyone who has a job above her own minimum wage job. Unions have negotiated contracts that increased the standard of living for their workers. And by proxy all American workers. In companies that have both union and salaried workers, the salaried workers are just as interested in the union increases , they know that the bar has been set, they will not get less.

BeyondGreen. I agree with some of what you say with regards to your ideas for energy independence, but you forgot a couple of other key things. We need to DRILL our own oil. Both off the coasts & the oil shale in Utah. The technology to accomplish both of these things in an envoirnmentally safe way exists NOW. This will provide us with a cushion of time to further refine the green technologies that you spoke of. Let's face it. Ethanol is an f-ing joke. Not only does it cost more to ship, but it also has recently discovered side effects to engines, & most of all, it's KILLING world food prices. There are better ways of making ethanol without burning our food in our gas tanks. As far as the UAW is concerned, I'll beleive the true measure of their resolve to be part of the solution when I see it. These clowns have been bleeding the very companies that employ them FOR YEARS! All for their employees to make more, in some cases, than a professional like a layer, doctor, & MOST CERTAINLY TEACHERS! I'm not saying that I think any one job is more important than the other, but this is NOT the early 1900's. People are no longer being worked to death (literally) or to the point of being maimed. So why do these auto workers need to make almost $70 plus bucks an hr., w/bennies factored in? Like I said, I know its hard work, but good God. I work in a high end professional kitchen. I get screamed & cursed at daily by a psycho coke head Italian chef. I work nights, weekends, & most holidays. I work 65-70 hrs a week (during the holidays, sometimes 90), 10-13 hrs a day, mostly 6 days a week. For all of my hard work as a sous chef, I'm paid the marvelous sum of just over 35k a yr. All this is not to say poor me. I know that in order to escape this type of work, I'll need to either become my own boss(even then, it's pretty tough to own your own shop)or I'll need to find another line of work. From my own experiences working in a REAL "tough guy" industry, where the mandated break times & vacation times of union guys are pilloried on a regular basis, I have NO sympathy for these over endulged, non-hard working auto workers! Some of the footage I've seen of these people at work in these plants show some women wearing SKIRTS for God's sake! How hard can the job REALLY be anymore?

NavyBrat wrote: I work in a high end professional kitchen. I get screamed & cursed at daily by a psycho coke head Italian chef. I work nights, weekends, & most holidays. I work 65-70 hrs a week (during the holidays, sometimes 90), 10-13 hrs a day, mostly 6 days a week. For all of my hard work as a sous chef, I'm paid the marvelous sum of just over 35k a yr. All this is not to say poor me. I know that in order to escape this type of work, I'll need to either become my own boss(even then, it's pretty tough to own your own shop)or I'll need to find another line of work. From my own experiences working in a REAL "tough guy" industry, where the mandated break times & vacation times of union guys are pilloried on a regular basis, I have NO sympathy for these over endulged, non-hard working auto workers! Some of the footage I've seen of these people at work in these plants show some women wearing SKIRTS for God's sake! How hard can the job REALLY be anymore? ************************************** NavyBrat you have made the case better than I ever could. YOU NEED A UNION! Most of these union haters are in the same situation as you. They hate unions because they aren't in one. A union would either cut your hours or get you more pay and get the coke head chef to treat you with the respect you deserve.

I don't want a damn union! Look at what they've done to the auto industry. That's just what we need is a union to turn my honored profession into one for pansy-assed people who think that they aren't being treated "fairly." This biz is tough. And rightly so. If you can't hack the load under the circumstances I mentioned previously, then you don't need to be in the cooking biz. Maybe you didn't read my comments closely enough. We make fun of union pukes BECAUSE THEY DON"T WORK HARD! At least by going through all that I have in this profession, I've EARNED everything that's come my way. I would never stand idly by & let some sissy who doesn't like to work get all the same pay, bennies, & defernece that I have sweated & in some cases, corny but true, bled for. Cooking at this level is kinda like the military. If you can't hack it through boot camp on your OWN merits & intestinal fortitude, you don't belong in the military. Same principle as a busy kitchen. Finally, it would be VERY un-kosher for me to pay union dues to an entity that I can only assume will use my money to support candidates & labor policies I don't like or agree with. The hospitality union in Vegas for instance turned out for Obama like no one's buisness. That's not to say that they'd FORCE their members to vote for anyone in particular, but like I said, I wouldn't want MY money, taken out of MY check (along with un Godly taxes), to support things like that. Keep your stupid unions & organized labor! I'll be happy in my work. At least I EARN what I make the hard way!

Truthspeaker. All of the "injustices" that I spoke of with regards to this aspect of my profession are a simple fact. It takes all kinds to do certain things. Guys like Gordon Ramsay, Anthony Bourdain, & Eric Ripert don't have 1st class kitchens by being "nice guys". They certainly didn't come up in the profession like that. In order to get a true insight as to why those of us who REALLY love this biz put up with the abuse that we do, you should read Kitchen Confidential & The Nasty Bits, both by Anthony Bourdain. You can get some idea of WHY things are done this way in this biz by reading Bourdain's books. His opinions about the biz are taken as gospel by most guys like me & can help to relate the "animalistic" nature of the biz to Suzie Homemaker & Joe Schmo types who don't understand the nature of the beast.

NavyBrat wrote: Maybe you didn't read my comments closely enough. We make fun of union pukes BECAUSE THEY DON"T WORK HARD! At least by going through all that I have in this profession, I've EARNED everything that's come my way. I would never stand idly by & let some sissy who doesn't like to work get all the same pay, bennies, & defernece that I have sweated & in some cases, corny but true, bled for. *************************************** NavyBrat, I read it fine, on some of your long weeks 90 hrs you make less than minimum wage, but you have the satisfaction that you are tough, on the off chance that some puke will not work as hard as you, you accept long hours,verbal abuse and 6 day work weeks. The union secured a high standard of living for Americans they in turn bought houses shopped in their towns and bought the cars they made. Now that is true trickle down. How many of the people making BMW's in South Carolina and making $14.00 an hr will buy BMW's.

Truthspeaker- I always find it funny when people get personal in these comment sections. Ordinarily I ignore this nonsense, but as a former business woman who NEGOTIATED UNION CONTRACTS for a large industry, I feel compelled to respond. In the company I used to work for, the union employees made more money than many of their non-union managers. There was little incentive for employees to perform better than their coworkers, because everything was based on seniority. Additionally, it was very difficult to for us to gain new business and retain current customers due to our high labor rates. The real truth is that many unions today are putting their companies out of business. Isn't that the deal with the auto-industry? And the other truth- people with little skills and education cannot expect to make the same salaries as those with specialized trades and degrees. We are taking away all incentive in the country to work hard and achieve - whether as an individual or as a business. In fact, we are bailing out all the losers at the expense of the successful.

Truthspeaker. I guess it would then be incumbent upon those folks making $14 an hr., in order to own that BMW, to make a career change. Now that I'm rapidly approaching "burn out" phase in the culinary biz, I know I'll have to man up, clean up my resume, & get me an office job. The pay will be better & the bennies more comprehensive. I HAVE a college degree. I realize that amongst my contemporaries, this is a rarity. Yet many of my contemporaries recognize higher education as one of the key stepping stones to getting that better paying job if they don't wanna be "galley slaves" for the rest of their days. It's all in personal CHOICE. You CHOOSE to put up with the intricacies of the high end kitchen biz. You can also CHOOSE to better educate yourself in order to attain the lifestyle you think that you should have. I appreciate your honesty in conveying your point. I just happen to feel as if the day of the union is passed. I now live in Pittsurgh, 10 min from Homestead, PA where steel workers set the river on fire to keep the Pinkerton union busters from landing thier skiffs to cause mayhem. These steel workers were treated like slave labor. This no longer happens in this country. When unions become a burden for the industries whose workers they represent, you have the situation that we are in now. As we all know, this is not a good thing for the union members OR the companies that employ them. The unions need to chill out with some of their demands & be realistic, otherwise, there'll be no buisness or workers to represent. Good talkn to you as always, Truthspeaker. As usual, I respect your opinion, & I will agree to disagree with you on what steps the unions need to take to cease being the burden that they have become. You really SHOULD check out those Bourdain books if you haven't already, though. In addition to getting a keen insight into the high end culinary biz, you'll get a whole lot of good laughs out of it.

Janis wrote:In the company I used to work for, the union employees made more money than many of their non-union managers. There was little incentive for employees to perform better than their coworkers, because everything was based on seniority. Additionally, it was very difficult to for us to gain new business and retain current customers due to our high labor rates. The real truth is that many unions today are putting their companies out of business. Isn't that the deal with the auto-industry? And the other truth- people with little skills and education cannot expect to make the same salaries as those with specialized trades and degrees. *********************************** Janis, do I detect a bit of elitism in your tone? Is it not true that the people in the unions who are in the higher paying jobs have been in those jobs for a number of years. Those are the people who will know the intricate details of how everything meshes they have seen managers come and go and things continue smoothly until a new manager is appointed. Lack of incentive is a red herring. Bad management thinks you need some kind of threat to make people work. Good management knows better. A good manager knows that it is about managing people well, if you do that and treat them fairly, they will bust their tails for you.